Phillies 2025-2026 Hot Stove Discussion

[zambonir]

The only way it would get interesting is if JT (or whomever they get instead of him) or Marchan gets hurt and they don't want to expose Stubbs to waivers. Hard to really know if Stubbs seriously hopes to make the team out of ST over Marchan, let alone if he's an option in a JT-less universe. It may already be understood that he's being paid well in AAA to be a quasi-coach. And then he'll actually become one.

[fish]

How is it that there are no stories of Imai visiting teams with a week left?

[zambonir]

Good question. Seems like he's not visiting any markets in person, or even hosting a cattle call somewhere. Or everyone's keeping a tight lid. I wonder if there's a chance he doesn't sign (rather than taking a lesser deal like Murakami). I don't really recall really seeing much coverage of the two 3B meeting with teams either. As much effort as was put in to past player, seems like the Zoom age has taken over.

If there's not much competition for him that would certainly be an opportunity for the Phillies.

[VoteForKalas]

If there's not much competition for him that would certainly be an opportunity for the Phillies.

Man, that is a damning statement. We are such total no-shows in the international market.

[zambonir]

Well, sure. But it's always been a small market, especially of Japanese players (versus Korea/Taiwan) and teams that get 'em. Not many of them, and only a few teams have done it consistently. And I still don't think the Phillies can easily overcome the cultural and geographic disadvantage. If the four or five teams that are either freer-spending or have more of a track record sitting it out is what finally breaks the damn, great. It's not like Texas ever signed another Japanese player after Yu. And clearly nobody else really wanted Murakami badly.

[allentown]

Man, that is a damning statement. We are such total no-shows in the international marke

Yes, and that has really hurt the team over the years. When I first started following the Phillies, back in the mid-50s they greatly suffered by being so late to sign Black or Hispanic stars from Negro league or Latin America. We were probably the whitest team in basball, when so many of the superstar position players were POC.

[fish]

When I first started following the Phillies, back in the mid-50s they greatly suffered by being so late to sign Black or Hispanic stars from Negro league or Latin America.

Offf topic, but It really is pretty remarkable the multitude of players that came into the league over that 15 year period that put up big seasons for clubs even like the Indians and Senators and the Phillies were seemingly content to stink than evolve.

[zambonir]

Kazuma Okamoto Travels To U.S. For In-Person Meetings

Phillies not seen as a player but his posting date is January 4. Imai's is January 2.

The Phillies, let's face it, are just bad at all of it. The international market (Japanese/other Asia/Cuban) is totally different from the international amateur market which is totally different from the domestic market in terms of both scouting and acquisition method but it's all been bad since the Arbuckle/Wade World Series core. The Wolever years at least got us stars or near-stars in Hoskins and Ranger and Nola; since then it's pretty much just Bohm and Stott.

It does seem like international is finally moving in a better direction, and as far as the Asian players all they can do is keep trying.

The whiteness and culture of the team is still no small thing, I reckon. There's not much the Phillies can do if a player who is used to Tokyo can't be swayed by a Rittenhouse condo and six great sushi or izakaya places (let alone a mansion in South Jersey). But they're also walking into a clubhouse with only seven or eight non-white players, and an extremely Southern/Midwest/religious American vibe.

[Austinfan]

Blame the Carpenters.

And baseball for preventing Bill Veeck from buying the team - he wanted to bring in Negro league stars before Jackie Robinson - Phillies could have been the Brooklyn Dodgers.

[phillychuck]

It’s not a good look right now (last year) for the historically racist Phils to field a lineup of 9 white guys, especially when 30% of baseball is latin ethnicity, 6% are black, and 4% are asian. I’m not accusing the current Phils administration of racism, and at least the pitching staff is diverse. It’s still embarrassing to look back at the Phils’ history.

[zambonir]

Yup that's just what you get from insitutional, historic and structural racism, even if you're not overtly racist. Ironically the only non-white position player of the nine is the one who got benched, and won't be here this year (though we've replaced both him and Bader with a Latin player, and are adding Crawford). And one of the only two Black players got released (Ross), while the other is still our most marginal starting pitcher.

And, let's face it, the roster also reflects the influence of our shadow GM.

Three times as many Jewish players by percentage last year (in September) compared to the US population though!

[phillychuck]

I don’t know if they are racist, but it would be weird if they were racist, institutionally or otherwise, with respect to position-player starters, and more diverse than the average team with their subs and pitching staff. Suarez, Sanchez, Luzardo, Walker, Alvarado, Duran, Sosa, Rojas, Marchan...9 of the other 16 roster players are either latin or black (or both, in Walker’s case).

Still the starting “9” is not a good look.

[Austinfan]

To be fair, Rojas got a fair shot to start in CF.

[zambonir]

But are they actually more diverse than the average team that way? Anecdotally it seems like there is a deeper pool of Latin relief pitchers and bench players (and probably catchers too).

A lot of different factors involved, including concidence, to where the Phillies have been able to compensate for their poor internal development via trade or free agency, and younger cheaper Latin players have come via the former avenue, with expensive white players coming via the latter (except for Walker). Some of the Latin players were also not yet developed (Alvarado, Sanchez).

Separate from race, Walker and Casty and Luzardo were all domestic players (and English speakers). Obviously the Phillies seem to support their Latin players well (with Veladia at the top and a full-time translator. Five of the 12 major league coaches now are also Latin). The low number of starters is more about failing to develop enough of the signings.

I think the main reason the Phillies would do well to just have a Japanese player of any kind would be as a reason to lay the foundation of a support system, and set an example, for the next guy. They took a wild roll of the dice at that last year with the reliever, then quickly found out why no other team wanted him.

[andyb]

I don’t know if they are racist, but it would be weird if they were racist, institutionally or otherwise, with respect to position-player starters, and more diverse than the average team with their subs and pitching staff. Suarez, Sanchez, Luzardo, Walker, Alvarado, Duran, Sosa, Rojas, Marchan...9 of the other 16 roster players are either latin or black (or both, in Walker’s case).

Still the starting “9” is not a good look.

They are not racist per se. Just think it is possible they have unconscious bias in how they approach some player decisions. Whenever we read that a Harper or Schwarber is a perfect fit for Philly we are kind of saying that the team is willing to give them extra chances because the fans will love them regardless. White players might be attracted to play in Philly also as non-white players might be hesitant.

With Latin American players they have had their developmental issues which hopefully have been solved by now, but they sure seem eager to trade guys like Caba before they trade their draft prospects. They gave a JP Crawford less chance to impress than they gave Stott or Bohm.

This does not make them a bad organization. In most cases the decisions they make have sound baseball foundations. Trading Caba meant trading a risky prospect. Just as signing Schwarber and Turner were legit free agents getting market value. There is a bit of a pattern of behavior though from the organization. Sometimes one needs to look around a bit and self correct before it becomes an issue.

[Matt_Winkelman]

You can say the org needs to look around, but also there are foundational issues in the sport causing these problems too. Teams are drafting fewer HS players due to draft bonus restrictions and NIL money in college, those kids are less diverse than ever due to the cost to play baseball. That means the average Latin American signing (17 with shifted signing and eligibility date) is 4-5 years younger than most draftees, they hit Rule 5 protection by the time college guys are being drafted and used up options before those guys are even Rule 5 eligible. It is hard for teams that have competitive MLB teams to devote roster space to these players to develop. You see teams like the Rays churn done of these guys for new draftees and late signing/blooming Latin guys. It is how Sanchez ended up with the Phillies and he nearly ran out of option runway. Yes the Phillies need to get better, but much of the causes are structural.

[zambonir]

It's also kind of a Philadelphia thing. I mean, we may not be Boston. But the Phillies have always glorified (and employed) their feisty white guys (Bowa, Vuke, Morandini), while Chase was something of a Larry Bird-type, a genuine star, but also more popular than his equally talented Black teammates with a big part of the fan base. You could put Pete Rose in either category, considering he wasn't actually a star producer during his time here.

The Phillies' love of guys like David Bell and Michael Young as "good in the clubhouse" is also race-coded.

See also, Abreu vs. Rowand, or even how popular Werth or Marsh are compared to Bobby.

[zambonir]

Separately from the bigger developmental picture though, the Phillies do somehow manage to choose the white guy every time.

Harper over Machado

Kingery over Crawford even if they also added Segura

Bohm drafted #3 ahead of two Hispanic players #4 and 5, though you can certainly see how the draft, including the Stott draft, is mostly white.

Traded for Marsh, Bader, JT, replacing a Latin player each time, even if for very good baseball reasons each time.

Schwarber (and then re-signed him, and hopefully JT too).

Turner (with a roster spot opened by Segura's free agency)

[zambonir]

So, meetings did go down. Whether the Phillies had or will have one, dunno, but they certainly are tight with Boras.

Imai probably signs by Thursday so he can have a physical.

What we’re hearing about MLB offseason: Tyler Soderstrom, Brendan Donovan and...

Pitcher Tatsuya Imai’s posting deadline is Jan. 2, while corner infielder Kazuma Okamoto’s posting deadline to sign with an MLB team is Jan. 4. Agent Scott Boras represents both players from Japan. Both players traveled to the U.S. to meet with teams. A few teams already met recently with Imai in Los Angeles, league sources said. Additional meetings are expected this week.

[Philsmania]

Separately from the bigger developmental picture though, the Phillies do somehow manage to choose the white guy every time.

Harper over Machado

Kingery over Crawford even if they also added Segura

Bohm drafted #3 ahead of two Hispanic players #4 and 5, though you can certainly see how the draft, including the Stott draft, is mostly white.

Traded for Marsh, Bader, JT, replacing a Latin player each time, even if for very good baseball reasons each time.

Schwarber (and then re-signed him, and hopefully JT too).

Turner (with a roster spot opened by Segura's free agency)

It's not just the organization. It's the fanbase, too. Even in a supposedly liberal Northeast city like Philadelphia. The fanbase favors white players and the organization responds to that.

Ironically, in both of the Phillies golden ages (1974-83 and 2001-11), there were significant contributions from players of color (Dick Allen's second Phillies act, Garry Maddox, Bake McBride, Manny Trillo, Lonnie Smith, Gary Matthews and even to some extent Bo Diaz and Ivan DeJesus in the first golden age, Jimmy Rollins, Ryan Howard, Carlos Ruiz, part-Polynesian Shane Victorino, Pedro Feliz, Raul Ibanez, Placido Polanco and JC Romero in the second golden age--and 2008 had the Japanese So Taguchi on the bench). Even 1993 with all of its working class white guy vibe had Milt Thompson, Wes Chamberlain and Mariano Duncan (albeit in platoon roles) with Ricky Jordan as the top pinch hitter and Ben Rivera as the 5th starter.