17 Phillies (Lively) in Arizona (Ray)

Austinfan 2017-06-25 14:00:34 UTC #21

Lively struggled but hung in there.
However, he showed why secondary pitches are so important when you have a decent but not great FB.
91-93 works if you locate and keep hitters offbalance, but if they can wait on it, your command better be perfect.
But that's part of the ML learning process, what works in AAA ball doesn't always work at this level.

VoteForKalas 2017-06-25 16:03:37 UTC #22

I think this is the crux of the current debate.

I disagree the current talent level would be producing a significantly better record. The team is performing 3 games under the pythagorean W-L projection, but that should balance out over the season. The reality the W-L projection is 27-46 still tells us this team is horrible. 283 runs have been scored for compared to 379 against for a -96 total - that is bad.

We remember the Utley, Rollins, Howard trio of the previous core, but tend to forget how the acquisitions of Moyer, Werth and Vic not to mention the assembled bullpen really helped us win more consistently.

I agree a foundational piece of success needs to be via the draft and development route, but we also need to utilize the other means i.e. trades, FA, rule 5, international etc. much more aggressively to fortify the roster, support the youth and provide a baseline of performance that can be built upon.

The Phillies under Gillick & Amaro waited too long to get the rebuild started which we are still paying the price for, but now the Phillies under MacPhail and Klentak are waiting too long IMO to kick the rebuild into a more urgent gear.

Austinfan 2017-06-25 17:20:29 UTC #23

I think patience is in order right now.
A year from now, we'll have a logjam of young OF prospects, but let's fill out the ML roster before we start shopping guys.
Let's see if Franco can revive, if Crawford can figure it out, how kingery does in AAA, whether Williams is learning to be a disciplined hitter, etc.
Same with pitching, we have six young starters, a couple more possibilities in AAA and in AA ball, let's see how they develop.

Rebuilding and urgency don't go together, a good rebuild requires patience, not hasty decisions.
The point is to build up the talent base, and that requires "buy low, sell high."
And you only do that by patiently waiting for the right opportunity to come along.