2017 Phillies Wall of Fame vote

[Lawman]

I didn't see that last piece, so that gives me pause. But, the other legal troubles don't bother me as much.

[zambonir]

Lenny should probably be on there. Honestly, I think the Phillies are too selective, they started it in 1978 and it's one guy a year, they should have put more people in en masse when it started, or occasionally do 2 or even 3 players when a cluster of great teams come into the rotation.

Or, most simply, separate players and non-players (between 2006 and 2009 only one player got on).

There's no way I would put Lenny in over Abreu (though again, for the zillionth time, Abreu hasn't been eligible yet) but it doesn't really make sense, all else being equal, that Lenny wouldn't have been in well before Abreu came up.

But of course as everyone is noting, all else is not equal. Lenny did go to prison in 2012 and he is still a PR nightmare, so I'm sure that's been the issue. He's been eligible since 2002 or so but if you look at who they inducted between then and 2012 there is no one you'd pick him over.

[Philsmania]

I also don't recall Dykstra stories of him betting on games where he could help determine the outcome. There were accusations but I believe baseball cleared him, https://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/columnist/saraceno/2005-04-27-saraceno-dykstra_x.htm

Dykstra is still a pretty sleazy guy though with a history of crude, illegal and misogynistic behavior. "Well, he's not as bad as Rose", whether true or not, isn't exactly a ringing endorsement of his character. It's almost like saying "Well, Mussolini wasn't as bad as Hitler." He was still a fascist dictator.

[bkox]

I never even realized there were allegations about gambling with Dykstra. But I know he has a history of tax evasion, fraud and sexual misconduct.. Like this sexual harassment of a 17year old. He was cleared because they felt they didnt have enough to convict
"While the district attorney believes that the defendant did engage in the conduct as originally described by the victim, the subsequent investigation revealed additional facts which leads to the conclusion that the charges alleged in the complaint cannot be proven beyond a reasonable doubt to a jury,"

Dykstra Cleared Of Charges

and then there is this:

Lenny Dykstra claims he spied on umpires' gay sex to get favorable calls

If its true... how much difference is there between blackmail to change game play and gambling on your team and making decision that affect game play (which Rose claims he never did)

[zambonir]

The difference between Rose and Dykstra, logistically, is that Dykstra has actually been considered for the wall, and hasn't made it in, though as I said above that's largely because the Phillies had a backlog of clearly stronger or more sentimental candidates for ten years (including two of his teammates and Green, Vukovich and Harry).

For instance in 2009 he, Kruk and Daulton were all on the ballot. Then Harry died. Kruk and Daulton got in the next two years and by then Lenny was poison.

Phillies 2009 Wall of Fame Choice is Tough

Whereas Rose had never even been part of the selection process until this year, and the Phillies (like the Reds before them) had to ask MLB for permission to include him. So yeah, whatever the moral equivalencies it is obvious the people who run the Phillies and the Wall selection committee wanted Rose on there, and don't have strong (positive) feelings about Lenny. I imagine if he was included in a fan poll he'd still do okay; question is, do you drop out of consideration if you aren't voted in after a certain number of tries?

With Rose, the narrative was also that he'd done his time and paid his debt and apologized, even though that is highly, highly debatable. But that's what he, MLB, the Reds and the Phillies were selling. And then something new and worse came along.